Comments on: Invisible http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible "Dear Church..." - stories from those that have left Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:02:02 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1 By: joann http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-447 joann Mon, 08 Dec 2008 15:02:29 +0000 http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-447 I hear "hurt" written all over your letter. It is a sad thing when "churches" fall into this mindset. My sister (single, no children) faces the same thing. Where they use her talents the most is in their Celebrate Recovery program (Christian version of AA) and everyone thinks she has time to spare since she has no "family." I believe she feels taken advantage of quite a bit. For myself, I took a break from church a few months ago, thinking I would be back eventually. (you can read my letters "Divine Healing" and "xmas") As you contemplate your next move, I wish you all peace and joy. Maybe even examine what and why you believe. I have come to acknowledge that God is way bigger than the boxes I have put Him in all my life. I hear “hurt” written all over your letter. It is a sad thing when “churches” fall into this mindset. My sister (single, no children) faces the same thing. Where they use her talents the most is in their Celebrate Recovery program (Christian version of AA) and everyone thinks she has time to spare since she has no “family.” I believe she feels taken advantage of quite a bit. For myself, I took a break from church a few months ago, thinking I would be back eventually. (you can read my letters “Divine Healing” and “xmas”)
As you contemplate your next move, I wish you all peace and joy. Maybe even examine what and why you believe. I have come to acknowledge that God is way bigger than the boxes I have put Him in all my life.

]]> By: P_Wright http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-462 P_Wright Fri, 23 Jan 2009 20:10:55 +0000 http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-462 Invisible, I can SO relate to where you are coming from. It's very sad but true, and if you are unhappy you are apt to be told that it's your fault. It's heartbreaking really, but I am so happy to have found a community of online believers who are living loved and are all about the Father and living in His love and grace. It's not the same as being physically nearby and joining in activities together with those who are on the same page, but they really weren't on the same page in the "churches". But I'm learning that you can live loved and share that with anyone you meet. If you are secure in Him you can be anywhere and share that love with others whether they believe or not. There are many, many who are hurting and just need an ear or a hug or a kind word. The thing I am finding is to reach out, not in. Reaching in just stirs up the hurt. Reaching out heals the hurt. Invisible, I can SO relate to where you are coming from. It’s very sad but true, and if you are unhappy you are apt to be told that it’s your fault. It’s heartbreaking really, but I am so happy to have found a community of online believers who are living loved and are all about the Father and living in His love and grace. It’s not the same as being physically nearby and joining in activities together with those who are on the same page, but they really weren’t on the same page in the “churches”. But I’m learning that you can live loved and share that with anyone you meet. If you are secure in Him you can be anywhere and share that love with others whether they believe or not. There are many, many who are hurting and just need an ear or a hug or a kind word. The thing I am finding is to reach out, not in. Reaching in just stirs up the hurt. Reaching out heals the hurt.

]]> By: satanIsAdork http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-470 satanIsAdork Thu, 05 Mar 2009 15:53:46 +0000 http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-470 Dear Invisible, Your post leaves me so disappointed in the organized church today. There is little doubt that man had done his best to mess up what God had intended for good. I do believe that God's plan for us was to be in a church like environment. You can see all through the Hebrew Scriptures (old Testament) that God assembled the believers (Jews at that time) together. Either at the Temple or at a local synagogue. Now with that said I also believe that He left us in charge and it doesn't take a genius to figure out that we fall very short in being good stewards of the church (body and building). I was so much like you not so long ago, I had been seriously "burned by my church" and wasn't sure weather or not I would ever go back to a physical church building. My wife and I along with our two children ended up moving across the country from California to North Carolina within two months of our leaving our old church. We started to pray about what God would have us do and if He wanted us in a church then He needed to find it for us. We left is totally in His hands. I was driving down the freeway one day about two months after arriving in North Carolina and heard a Pastor come on the radio. He was talking about doing church in a different way and his ending tag line was "this might just be what you've been looking for" he then gave the address. I was about 45 minuets from my house on the freeway and the address he have was at the next exit ahead of me. I took the exit and drove past the church. The building was a converted manufacturing plant that had been converted (totaly green which I thought was cool) and it just felt right. That Sunday I took my family and we have been there for almost two years. One of the things that got me on the first Sunday and made me pay attention was that they did not pass a plate. They had tithe boxes in the back but never pushed you to put anything in. The pastor believes that, that is between you and God. I will say though that because an emphasis is not put on tithing but on your relationship with God my wife and I are for the first time in our lives tithing our full 10% as our first fruits and that is of the net not the gross. Its the first thing we give at the beginning of the month and let me tell you something brother we have been so blessed since we started doing that. In the end Invisible I hope you find what you are looking for what ever that may be. I just hope that it is Him you follow and not your head. People will always fail you (even church leadership) they are flesh and are as weak in their flesh as anyone. Christ will never fail you though. Take care and may God richly bless you, you are not invisible to Him nor me! Your brother in Christ, Ken burnedbychurch.com Dear Invisible,
Your post leaves me so disappointed in the organized church today. There is little doubt that man had done his best to mess up what God had intended for good. I do believe that God’s plan for us was to be in a church like environment. You can see all through the Hebrew Scriptures (old Testament) that God assembled the believers (Jews at that time) together. Either at the Temple or at a local synagogue. Now with that said I also believe that He left us in charge and it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that we fall very short in being good stewards of the church (body and building). I was so much like you not so long ago, I had been seriously “burned by my church” and wasn’t sure weather or not I would ever go back to a physical church building. My wife and I along with our two children ended up moving across the country from California to North Carolina within two months of our leaving our old church. We started to pray about what God would have us do and if He wanted us in a church then He needed to find it for us. We left is totally in His hands. I was driving down the freeway one day about two months after arriving in North Carolina and heard a Pastor come on the radio. He was talking about doing church in a different way and his ending tag line was “this might just be what you’ve been looking for” he then gave the address. I was about 45 minuets from my house on the freeway and the address he have was at the next exit ahead of me. I took the exit and drove past the church. The building was a converted manufacturing plant that had been converted (totaly green which I thought was cool) and it just felt right. That Sunday I took my family and we have been there for almost two years. One of the things that got me on the first Sunday and made me pay attention was that they did not pass a plate. They had tithe boxes in the back but never pushed you to put anything in. The pastor believes that, that is between you and God. I will say though that because an emphasis is not put on tithing but on your relationship with God my wife and I are for the first time in our lives tithing our full 10% as our first fruits and that is of the net not the gross. Its the first thing we give at the beginning of the month and let me tell you something brother we have been so blessed since we started doing that. In the end Invisible I hope you find what you are looking for what ever that may be. I just hope that it is Him you follow and not your head. People will always fail you (even church leadership) they are flesh and are as weak in their flesh as anyone. Christ will never fail you though.

Take care and may God richly bless you, you are not invisible to Him nor me!

Your brother in Christ,
Ken

burnedbychurch.com

]]> By: sewladysew http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-483 sewladysew Sat, 09 Jan 2010 03:27:19 +0000 http://lettersfromleavers.com/feeder/?FeederAction=clicked&feed=Articles+%28RSS2%29&seed=http%3A%2F%2Flettersfromleavers.com%2Fblog%2F2008%2F12%2F05%2Finvisible%2F&seed_title=Invisible#comment-483 I read the letter and I hated it. Not that he wrote the letter, but that he felt it was necessary to write. So, here is what I would say if he had had a cup of coffee with me. The New Testament was full of letters from Paul to churches that were in trouble. Either they were being selfish, teaching incorrect doctrine, women were bickering, and on and on. The church, the bride of Christ, the church, the body of believers that Christ loves and protects and died for, was imperfect then and still is today. But, we are to be part of that body, as imperfect as it is because He told us to. Here's the thing...going to church is not about us. It is about joining with other believers, coming together to worship God and bring Him honor and glory. We live in a day when everything is about us, our comfort, our needs being met, our happiness, our dreams. But when you read scripture, it is all about God and HIs honor and His glory, His mercy, His grace, His love and His justice. We are the blessed recipients of His grace and His mercy and His redemption. So...what to do about churches that we feel don't meet our needs. Here is what I think...since you asked. Find a body of believers where you are certain the Word of God, the Bible, is believed to be the inspired word of God and infallible and inerrant in it's original form. It is the written source of authority from God and should be the only source of doctrine. Then, make sure that the church teaches from scripture and holds to all of the basic tenants of the Christian faith, the Trinity, Jesus is the son of God and yet God and is the redeemer, the importance of the sacraments of baptism and communion, the Holy Spirit, that one must repent and be born again to be saved from eternal damnation, etc. Then decide what you want the church to look like in it's servanthood capacity. If it is lacking as the writer of the letter felt it was, then change it! Be the one to start a soup kitchen, be the one to start a ministry for singles, be the one to set up activities that include both marrieds and singles, be the one to make sure the orphans and the widows are cared for, be the one to become a missionary, be the one to start a jail ministry, be the one to start a homeless shelter, be the one to do the things you think the church should do but isn't. Why in the world do we all think someone else should be the one to do what we all think churches should do? Be the one to start it if you don't like what is missing. Stop complaining about the church and be Jesus' hands and feet to the world, to your community, to your family, to the poor and change something--if only one thing--change it if you don't like it. If you feel like they don't value your opinions, show them that you know what you are talking about and your thoughts can be respected. You see, maybe people are just too lazy to do anything and they want someone else to set everything up so they can jump in and spend an hour here or an hour there and feel good about themselves and what they did. Again I say, it is not about us and feeling important, or right, or valued! It is about God and honorig Him, not about feeling good. So everything we do and everything we say, should all be to honor Him. So we should selflessly serve one another and let it start with us! You think the church is doing it wrong? Quietly start participating and help to change it into what you believe Christ intended it to be. It will NEVER get better if everyone who sees it flaws walks away and shakes their head at it and says I am not going to go there because I am disappointed in it. Change it for Christ's sake! I read the letter and I hated it. Not that he wrote the letter, but that he felt it was necessary to write. So, here is what I would say if he had had a cup of coffee with me. The New Testament was full of letters from Paul to churches that were in trouble. Either they were being selfish, teaching incorrect doctrine, women were bickering, and on and on. The church, the bride of Christ, the church, the body of believers that Christ loves and protects and died for, was imperfect then and still is today. But, we are to be part of that body, as imperfect as it is because He told us to. Here’s the thing…going to church is not about us. It is about joining with other believers, coming together to worship God and bring Him honor and glory. We live in a day when everything is about us, our comfort, our needs being met, our happiness, our dreams. But when you read scripture, it is all about God and HIs honor and His glory, His mercy, His grace, His love and His justice. We are the blessed recipients of His grace and His mercy and His redemption. So…what to do about churches that we feel don’t meet our needs. Here is what I think…since you asked. Find a body of believers where you are certain the Word of God, the Bible, is believed to be the inspired word of God and infallible and inerrant in it’s original form. It is the written source of authority from God and should be the only source of doctrine. Then, make sure that the church teaches from scripture and holds to all of the basic tenants of the Christian faith, the Trinity, Jesus is the son of God and yet God and is the redeemer, the importance of the sacraments of baptism and communion, the Holy Spirit, that one must repent and be born again to be saved from eternal damnation, etc. Then decide what you want the church to look like in it’s servanthood capacity. If it is lacking as the writer of the letter felt it was, then change it! Be the one to start a soup kitchen, be the one to start a ministry for singles, be the one to set up activities that include both marrieds and singles, be the one to make sure the orphans and the widows are cared for, be the one to become a missionary, be the one to start a jail ministry, be the one to start a homeless shelter, be the one to do the things you think the church should do but isn’t. Why in the world do we all think someone else should be the one to do what we all think churches should do? Be the one to start it if you don’t like what is missing. Stop complaining about the church and be Jesus’ hands and feet to the world, to your community, to your family, to the poor and change something–if only one thing–change it if you don’t like it. If you feel like they don’t value your opinions, show them that you know what you are talking about and your thoughts can be respected. You see, maybe people are just too lazy to do anything and they want someone else to set everything up so they can jump in and spend an hour here or an hour there and feel good about themselves and what they did. Again I say, it is not about us and feeling important, or right, or valued! It is about God and honorig Him, not about feeling good. So everything we do and everything we say, should all be to honor Him. So we should selflessly serve one another and let it start with us! You think the church is doing it wrong? Quietly start participating and help to change it into what you believe Christ intended it to be. It will NEVER get better if everyone who sees it flaws walks away and shakes their head at it and says I am not going to go there because I am disappointed in it. Change it for Christ’s sake!

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